It’s such a hard discussion. No price is ever really going to be satisfactory for everyone. The problem is that to make the phone you want, where you want to make it, with the materials you want to use it’s going to be expensive. To create a business where none existed before and go up against gigantic companies that have been doing this for decades is never going to be cheap. You’ll be beaten on economy of scale every time not to mention the bigger companies more unethical approach to sourcing material and manufacturing the product.
This is the beginning and I’m sure the company will jump at the opportunity to make a more affordable product if this phone works and changes lives the way they hope it will.
To the critics, think how much you spend on "smart"phones that have zero battery life (so you have to buy an external battery to carry around with you), bloatware (that tracks you and makes the phones slow), bugs (in all parts of the OS), fragile hardware (that requires you to buy a case to put the phone in), and the whole thing ultimately lasts about 2 years before it blows up. Once you’ve considered that also consider that this is the beginning, they’re asking for money to grow a new business, to hopefully create a product that people will want. Possibly to even change the way we interact with our devices (which are actually changing our fundamental brain structure). The alternatives Punkt and Light Phone are more expensive and one of them isn’t even really a phone, just a tethered speaker and screen.
I’ve been pondering why no one has released a solid phone with an e-ink screen for years. I’ve also been using a brick Nokia for the past 10 years but it will be redundant next year when my country turns off the 3G network. I’m hoping this phone will give me exactly what I need. I will pay the price and if it is as good as it looks then it will be a solid investment. Time will tell. That’s the difference between crowd funding and buying a phone retail. Stick to your guns!
if shenzen parts are good enough for apple they are good enough for anyone.
Also just because the phones have parts coming from the US doesnt mean diddly, they were probably processed by prison labor to cut costs, like the furniture industry has done for decades.
Look, I dont care if these things are gold plated, they do not warrant these prices, period.
If you don’t care, why did you take the time to leave that comment?
People who genuinely don’t care, don’t spent time typing about things they don’t care about, especially not online. Therefore, it’s clear that you do care. You care enough to come here and tell us how much you care. What do you want us to say? We did our best, we’re a small team, sorry the phone price doesn’t meet your expectations but we’re not changing it.
From the beginning our goal was to use the most sustainable options available. Mudita Pure was designed, developed and manufactured in Europe with more than half of the components coming from the US. We produced as much of the phone as possible locally, including the casing and final assembly. We hand picked every single component and have developed a proprietary operating system to ensure the best experience.
There is a topic here which might help to understand why our price is what it is. We hope we will be able to inspire you to spend more time offline, even without Mudita Pure.
if you all cancelled your data plans, you’d have enough money to buy 2 of these by the time its released, and would be a great productive start to transitioning off smart phones
With all due respect I think you’re very very wrong. The time and efforts they are taking to ensure low SAR, their OWN operating system (that won’t sell your information because they have more values than what seems to be the present day America I live in) and the implementation of reintroducing or even initially introducing a large population of people to meditation (optimal for self growth, reflection, awareness and mindfulness). I am very glad I backed them early for the discount (because who doesn’t like saving money) but I support the impact this is going to make on the people that are willing to live their daily lives with more intent and less dopamine addicted relationships with their smartphones. I see where you’re coming from, but I hope you’ll see the intellect, effort, time and dedication and understand that the price of any company’s first product is never going to be perfect.
First I want to thank this team for creating something magnificent! Reading these posts is a little disheartening but indicative to the general consumer, “Give me what I want and give it to me NOW!” reminds me of that little girl in that Willie Wonka movie. Look creating something that is not mainstream and isn’t a piece of junk takes time and money. Anything innovative cost more to create and more to purchase in the beginning. This is basic economics. I look at this phone as an investment in myself, my health and environment. If others don’t see it that way I’m not sure why they are interested in this phone? The powers that be don’t have the power to change the industry, WE do! We change an unhealthy industry by supporting good ones, we speak with our wallets. Let’s get behind a great product. I’m sure there are a few that spend $5-6 a day on coffee? Give up drive through coffee and a night out and by distribution time you will have your money. Christmas is coming up many could ask for cash to go towards your new phone. Can’t wait to get my Mudita!
Before the Kickstarter campaign began, I imagined the price would be higher. Remember a few years ago when they did the Beats headphones teardown and people were having a bit of a fit over the true cost of a product? That is a nice example of cost vs price.
The cost of individual components of an individual will never reflect the true cost. Business may seem unethical to many of us on occasion but when you think about design costs (which is usually around 50% of the price) and all of the people involved in the supply chain, especially when a company makes an effort to be sustainable and ethical. Standard business practice is to multiply the cost of the product by 8 or 10 in order to account for every part of the supply chain, R&D, marketing, hosting.
So, Beats headphones cost $18 to make but sell for $200. I was expecting a $400 price for the Pure since so much of it is designed and made in-house. I do wish it were a little less expensive since it is still out of my price range.
@anon32618512 For what my $0.02 is worth, I think the price is fine. It’s more than a typical ‘feature phone’, but I really like the focus on getting out of the Google/Apple ecosystem, out of the attention economy, and a focus on health and wellness. For me, that’s worth the cost - and I’m happy to pay it to support businesses like yours!
@ludo, while I appreciate your feedback, the price of Mudita Pure is unlikely to change. Creating a phone from scratch isn’t cheap and particularly when you consider the amount of work that has gone into making sure it is developed in a more ethical manner. I hope you understand, stay well, stay safe.
Who are Your competitors? For example,
Do you compare prices of Nokia 2XX Dual SIm and Your Mudita Pure? What about rest specifications? other similar classic phones, who sell cheaper…
Regarding: /sustainable-harvested-materials/ and link to E-Ink documentation.
What do You see 1st? A banana? Then I would say: Chcę do drzewo…
Intro to e-ink technology in Your site. But what about the sustainability of those components?
From 2015 paper of H. K. Jeswani and A. Azapagic „Is e-reading environmentally more sustainable than conventional reading?“. Does „manufacturing of e-readers“ have environmental impact? and what about E-Ink tech and components? Please, bananas won’t help to solve the problem.
We have MuditaOS and NokiaOS. But where is the coop of the EU countries to withstand the big powers, which are outside of the EU?
I would gladly need an accessory to put my classic phone into the wrist, especially, while „running“. Then, maybe to have some other pluses as an environmental friendly case and so on.
The Mudita Pure data modem functionality is pretty good though.
We don’t see so-called “smart feature phones” like Nokia as our direct competitors. Nokia (which is only a brand name, the company behind these phones is HMD Global) is not running NokiaOS but KaiOS - a Linux-based operating system.
KaiOS mainly targets African countries and India - with the price as low as even $40 per device. Some people buy KaiOS based devices like the Banana Phone out of sentiment for the brand that used to be a global leader in mobile phones. For others, it’s the only way to connect to the Internet. It doesn’t mean that the difference between a $40 phone and Mudita Pure ($369) is a $330 margin that we make on the phone.
Once our phone is released you will be able to compare the quality of the devices and see for yourself why it costs more. What you can already check today are the specs and components that we use - just one example is the E Ink display, which is far more expensive than a “traditional” LCD display used in cheaper devices, but it also provides a totally different experience.
We believe in using high-quality components. There are people who are willing to pay more for a device with such components, and there are people who aren’t. It depends on what is important to you. Some people buy expensive houses or cars, others spend more money on durable shoes, and I can assure you that there are people who don’t want a generic, low-quality device because they believe in what we do as Mudita.
Mudita is a small company with big dreams. We don’t produce components. We choose them from the market. If there would be a cucumber-based E Ink display - I’m sure we would be the first to check it out. The problem of choosing natural materials isn’t as obvious as it seems. Let me share some examples:
Material for the phone/component has to be made with a certain precision (at least 0.1 mm). What can work for, let’s say, a chair or table, won’t necessarily work for a high precision device like a phone. The material needs to be injected in a repetitive manner and provide the same results for phone #1 and phone #10000.
Durability. It seems like a great idea to use biodegradable materials. But how would this device look like one year from now? Sweaty hands, drops of water in the kitchen or pouring rain will surely impact the durability of the device. Would you pay a premium price for a device that looks ugly after 6 months and which is falling apart after 12 months? I wouldn’t.
Last but not least: price and volume. Usually, it’s much more expensive to use custom materials, other than PC or ABS, especially with the low volumes that we produce. That would make Mudita Pure more expensive.
As for News of E-ink company (US):
2018-06-11
„E Ink Supports Taiwan Farmers Through Purchase of 8,000KG of Bananas“
Regarding KaiOS:
It’s only on Nokia 8110 4G
About NokiaOS I mean something like:
„flash and Nokia Series 30+ operating system“
About price:
If there exists patent, which could help for many people to be more healthly, then
why not try to get income for it? Does „flash and Not Android like“ phones would be good place to do so…
Now LCD and (or) E-Ink:
Which one are more sustainable in manufacturing it?
I own e-ink reader from „PockeBook International SA“ - Swiss company.
But, I don’t know, if their E-Ink tech suppliers are from across the Atlantic Sea.
And, I’m against the idea, that sustainability is only for buying the stuff to Supports Taiwan Farmers.
Does into sustainability matters:
How many lives of people needed to be sacrificed until rich people get’s toys with all those rare metals, which were used into the production?
Regarding Quality and price:
Maybe trying 3D printers from Germany. Some of them even possible to self-assemble, and if would be possible to make phone cases from „used plastic“ or so, then cheaper versions would be possible too… And it looks more „Greener“ project, than from around.
